Skill cap increase

Ixxie · Post by **Ixxie** » Sat Jul 11, 2015 12:11 pm

Squirrel, we talked about this a few days ago...i really really want this. Maybe an 8 or 900 cap? It lets you really round out a template without being crazy godmode, and since a lot of what we have to do here given the current playerbase is soloing stuff, that extra power boost is kind of mandatory if we want to get anything done

i'll make more cupcakes?

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Post by **Red Squirrel** » Sat Jul 11, 2015 1:20 pm

Something Death and I would have to discuss, it's kind of a major change, not code wise but gameplay wise. What I'm thinking is making it a vet reward, so we could definitely look into that when we redo those. 900 would probably be the absolute max that I'd want to go to, even then think I'd probably make it 800. To make it more fair I could also make it a special deed you can get either from roulette or other gambling method. Basically it would be something rather hard to get, but that anyone can get.

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Ixxie · Post by **Ixxie** » Sat Jul 11, 2015 2:45 pm

i'd go for that too, i really like the vet reward thing rather than the gambling thing.

It really just makes sense to raise it. 15 years ago when UO was just catching on, and there were only so many useful templates, 700 was just fine. That really isn't the case anymore. i don't think you should be able to be a tamer mage bard paladin archer ninja alchemist, but a thief that can do anything but run and hide would be nice. As it stands, the template is pretty limited. GM stealing/stealth/hiding/lockpicking leaves you 300 points with which to work, and no room for power scrolls. You could do so much more with just a little more room, right now even if you GM mage/med/eval with your 4 other skills she's only barely playable by herself and we just don't have the population to support anything other than solo play

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ggkthx · Post by **ggkthx** » Sun Jul 12, 2015 8:07 am

I HATE no skill cap or 1000 skill cap shards but I think I could definitely get behind a smaller increase like that. I look forward to tinkering with it if you decide to implement it.

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Post by **Death** » Sun Jul 12, 2015 12:18 pm

Raising the skill cap isn't necessarily needed as you can get skill bonuses on equipment and jewels. Right now it is a challenge to get some bonuses but with imbuing it will be easier to slap on 45 skill points to a ring or bracelet. You make a few sacrifices but gear revisions in the future will allow more flexibility.

Keep in mind we have not yet seen a significant impact to loot on the shard yet, such as imbuing, reforging, inherent armor bonuses and the random magical property system of loot. These systems allow you to get more skill points and run 800 skill templates with a bit of planning. We can investigate raising the cap at some point but we may not have to as the problem may be solved with other additions to loot and crafting.

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Ixxie · Post by **Ixxie** » Sun Jul 12, 2015 12:36 pm

ggkthx wrote:I HATE no skill cap or 1000 skill cap shards but I think I could definitely get behind a smaller increase like that. I look forward to tinkering with it if you decide to implement it.

Exactly. 1000 is too much and no cap is just obscene. Even if the soft cap stays the same but you can pack on the gear bonuses i'd be happy.

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dprantl · Post by **dprantl** » Sun Jul 12, 2015 11:32 pm

+1 for keeping the cap the same and implement imbuing. You can then make your own armor/jewels to increase whatever skills you choose.

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ggkthx · Post by **ggkthx** » Mon Jul 13, 2015 5:01 pm

Death wrote:Raising the skill cap isn't necessarily needed as you can get skill bonuses on equipment and jewels. Right now it is a challenge to get some bonuses but with imbuing it will be easier to slap on 45 skill points to a ring or bracelet. You make a few sacrifices but gear revisions in the future will allow more flexibility.

Keep in mind we have not yet seen a significant impact to loot on the shard yet, such as imbuing, reforging, inherent armor bonuses and the random magical property system of loot. These systems allow you to get more skill points and run 800 skill templates with a bit of planning. We can investigate raising the cap at some point but we may not have to as the problem may be solved with other additions to loot and crafting.

This is true, except where you've arbitrarily decided that real skill is needed and item bonuses don't count, unless this changed at some point and I don't remember that. Taming and Necromancy come to mind, not sure if there was any others.

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Post by **Death** » Mon Jul 13, 2015 6:18 pm

ggkthx wrote:
Death wrote:Raising the skill cap isn't necessarily needed as you can get skill bonuses on equipment and jewels. Right now it is a challenge to get some bonuses but with imbuing it will be easier to slap on 45 skill points to a ring or bracelet. You make a few sacrifices but gear revisions in the future will allow more flexibility.

Keep in mind we have not yet seen a significant impact to loot on the shard yet, such as imbuing, reforging, inherent armor bonuses and the random magical property system of loot. These systems allow you to get more skill points and run 800 skill templates with a bit of planning. We can investigate raising the cap at some point but we may not have to as the problem may be solved with other additions to loot and crafting.
This is true, except where you've arbitrarily decided that real skill is needed and item bonuses don't count, unless this changed at some point and I don't remember that. Taming and Necromancy come to mind, not sure if there was any others.

I've always frowned about this as it is primarily an osi implementation where skill bonus doesnt work with everything. An example is the tactics bonus on arms of tactical excellence. Unless you have over 90 tactics the arms are useless as you cannot use the skill bonus with primary and secondary abilities, which is kind of bogus.

I dont see a need to complicate skill bonus as you already sacrifice something for skill and as long as you maintain the use of the equipment or jewels then i dont see the need for having extra constraints.

For a skill like necromancy, for example, you can use jewels to cast the forms like vampiric embrace but you need to keep the skill bonus above the threshold with jewels. If you remove jewels and go under the form threshold, then it expires.

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ggkthx · Post by **ggkthx** » Tue Jul 14, 2015 10:56 pm

Yeah, that was a pretty cheaty use of necromancy but it was so niche I never saw it as a problem, just a clever use of items, shrug.

On the higher skill cap front, I think the primary issue is that there's been skills added and tweaked to actually be useful, and powerscrolls letting you take things to 120 etc and yet we have the same age old 720 skill cap (yes I know, we suffered with 700 for a long time, I played on OSI from the beginning). I'm honestly surprised OSI didn't do another at least small vet reward skill cap increase by now.

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Ixxie · Post by **Ixxie** » Wed Jul 15, 2015 1:23 am

At this point I'll pmuch take what I can get, but I'd far prefer an outright cap increase. Make it a vet reward if you're into that, an expensive one even, but we just don't have enough room to work with 720. Also, if we have to rely solely on jewels, it might be a while before that gets coded. It's kind of low priority.

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ggkthx · Post by **ggkthx** » Wed Jul 15, 2015 5:37 pm

Well, you can rely on jewels right now, no code required.
I just agree that that's not enough and it also means SO much farming to basically replace current gear with 'perfect' gear that is the same as current + a skill you need.
Because I'm not willing to sacrifice FC or FCR or LRC for example to switch to a crappier jewel that has +skill on it.

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Shanks · Post by **Shanks** » Thu Jul 16, 2015 5:25 pm

I wouldn't mind seeing an 820 skill cap. A 6mo or 1yr vet reward increase from 720 to 820. Seems pretty useful.

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Daelan · Post by **Daelan** » Sat Jul 18, 2015 1:52 pm

Ok I don't chime in on forums much but this I will give my two cents. (Or 10 Euros That you Greece)

I think at least 800 cap would be great, I am looking at my Chars that I have Multi +20 scrolls on and to get the boost I have to drain down one of my other skills.

900 would be Super Duper Zoobie Cow Wow Great but no more that. I have seen those lame ass shards that have 1000 or more and its just no fun at all.

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Ixxie · Post by **Ixxie** » Sat Dec 12, 2015 8:25 pm

guyssssss

900? 800?

please?

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Post by **Death** » Sun Dec 13, 2015 11:57 am

I'd say we need to play catch-up first with loot and properties as it's easy to get 45+ skill points on a single piece of jewelry with imbuing. This would involve coding imbuing first however (or changing masterpiece system).

I would say no for now but up for debate after loot bumping.

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Ixxie · Post by **Ixxie** » Sun Dec 13, 2015 2:32 pm

i'm fine with this too, but it sounds like the kind of thing that will take ages to implement

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Post by **Death** » Sun Dec 13, 2015 4:39 pm

Ixxie wrote:i'm fine with this too, but it sounds like the kind of thing that will take ages to implement

The complexity comes mostly from property weight, not so much the actual imbuing system. Basic imbuing is similar to the masterpiece system except being skill/gump based with more constraints and larger budget (points).

Because random loot can be imbued (any old sword or bone armor you loot for example), it adds to the complexity of implementing as we would need to first have a way to calculate property weights.

TL;DR property weight calculation is a pre-requisite to imbuing.

What I mean, for example, is a basic item has a budget of 500 or 550 points. Each property takes a certain percentage of points. For example, a super slayer would be a solid 130 points from the overall budget.

I will take a look at the current masterpiece system as extending the budget to 500/550 and tweaking the property weight of the masterpiece resources can probably suffice for the time being until we fulfill the pre-requisite for imbuing (mentioned above).

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ggkthx · Post by **ggkthx** » Thu Jul 06, 2017 1:59 pm

If this was even a vet reward that went incrementally like the 700-720 does it would be cool. increased cap periodically by 5 or 10 or 20 depending on the size of the time in between, with an absolute max of 800-900 pts.

I just think a system that anyone can do, that isn't imbuing or gear dependent would be nice. Even if it capped out at 780 or something. Would be fun to have some extra points to play around with. Skills going to 120 really eats up the cap quickly.

Anyway, sorry to An Corp this, just revisiting things we discussed awhile back that I would still love to see implemented in some fashion.

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Ixxie · Post by **Ixxie** » Thu May 24, 2018 8:26 am

Hi

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